Interview with Laura Jayes on Sky News AM Agenda

Laura Jayes

That is Andrew Bragg and he joins me live now. Thanks so much for your time. How many of your colleagues in the Liberal Party are already convinced by these arguments?

Senator Andrew Bragg

Well, good morning, Laura. I mean, this is a judgement for the Australian people. Obviously, as elected officials, we will be asked to give advice to the people about how they should consider voting and I believe it's essential, that if this is going to be a success, that a large portion of Coalition voting people will be voting 'yes'. And so that's why I think our engagement on this issue with the government is so terribly important.

Laura Jayes

It would be difficult for Peter Dutton to go down any other path than to give the Liberal Party room a free vote on this, wouldn't it?

Senator Andrew Bragg

Historically, when we've had public votes on Same-Sex Marriage, on the Republic referendum and even the aborted Local Government referendum in 2012-13, the Liberal Party has had 'yes' campaigns and has had 'no' campaigns. That is a feature of our recent history and I imagine that that is a convention that will be considered carefully

Laura Jayes

Okay, do you know where that's up to? Where we might get an answer, where you might get some clarity on it?

Senator Andrew Bragg

The government's got to do a better job of the process here. I mean, that's what Peter Dutton and Julian Leeser have been calling for. That is the first thing that needs to happen. I know that Peter is meeting with the working group again on the 17th. So once that has happened and there's been hopefully some further comfort provided about the detail, I imagine, then we'll have a further discussion.

Laura Jayes

Okay, the detail is one thing, but also that argument. Well we are going to get more detail eventually, but what it comes down to is the vote and what it is all about. And that is two things. Should there be a referendum and should we recognise that Indigenous people need a Voice there? Now, you've called for some kind of bipartisan committee. Do you think that will take a bit of the sting out of the politics here? Have you spoken to your own party about this? Do you have the backing for a bipartisan committee and is Labor open to the idea?

Senator Andrew Bragg

I think one of the risks here is that the government could introduce a Constitution Alteration Bill, that is a policy of the government when it could introduce a bill later in the year, which is a policy recommended by a bipartisan parliamentary committee. I think a reasonably short and sharp committee which looked at the amendment and the various legal risks which have been flagged would be immensely helpful. And I don't understand why that hasn't already been done, to be honest. I think there's still plenty of time for that to occur. I think the fact is that we need Coalition voting people, a portion of these people, to vote yes. If this is going to be successful. So we need to work together.

Laura Jayes

But would your own party, if this bipartisan committee was to be formed and made bipartisan recommendations, would your own party recognise those recommendations?

Senator Andrew Bragg

I think it would go a long way because there are people who are on the fence. There are people that are not sure how they would vote or how they would campaign. There are legitimate legal issues, I believe, that need to be properly investigated by the Parliament. I mean, that's our job is to look at these things. The Senate in particular has a strong tradition of interrogating and cross examining witnesses and positions. And as you know, there are many, many statements that have been made by people about what the Voice will and won't do. I think that there are red herrings and I think that there are also legitimate issues and we need to separate those and then make some recommendations.

Laura Jayes

What's your red line here? If this committee doesn't get up and there is an amendment to the Constitution Bill that is put forward, will you cross the floor and support that anyway?

Senator Andrew Bragg

I don't think it's going to be a matter of crossing the floor. I don't think anyone is seriously considering not facilitating the public having their say. I mean, even the monarchists voted for the Republic referendum in 99. So I haven't heard anyone suggest they want to stop the public having their say, because....

Laura Jayes

Well hang on, but in the last couple of days hasn't Peter Dutton confirmed that if we don't get more detail, if there is no more detail put forward, he won't lend his support, the party, the Liberal Party's support to this Bill, which is the first step in amending the Constitution isn't that right?

Senator Andrew Bragg

My interpretation of that is that the position is that if his issues aren't addressed and our issues aren't addressed on the detail, that people would vote 'no'. I don't think that's the same as saying that we wouldn't facilitate the peoples say. My sense would be that the peoples say is not really at risk here. That's my judgement. The real question is, can the referendum be successful? Will the government put in place a process that can address the substantial legal issues and will they provide the additional detail that's required? Because we need to be able to show the public that this change would make a difference on the ground that is critical.

Laura Jayes

Let me ask you one final question, I don't expect you to divulge what happened in party room, but I am told by multiple sources that Scott Morrison, when Peter Dutton wasn't in the room yesterday, told the party room that the Liberals and Nationals should make Jacinta Price's Bill on Stronger Futures, Coalition policy. Susan Ley said it warranted a broader discussion, obviously when the leader was there. And Scott Morrison essentially said made it known to the room that he thinks that the parties should just do that. There's been some pretty fiery reaction from Natasha Fyles, I might say. She's just said to us, "Scott Morrison is the Prime Minister who let the Northern Territory down. He and his party, including the Nationals, walked away from remote Territorians. His cabinet refused to look at alcohol management plans, his words mean very little now. His actions speak volumes and will do so for decades to come." Is that fair enough?

Senator Andrew Bragg

Well, I can't divulge what happens in party room, as you know, but certainly the question of advice to government and whether there were these sort of structures in place, I think is very valid. I mean, I can't say I'm an expert on everything in the Northern Territory, but if there was a permanent structure giving advice to government, that allowed for joint decision-making and that's really the key about the Voice. I mean, it's supposed to be advice to government, but it's also supposed to facilitate joint decision-making.

Laura Jayes

This was about the Stronger Futures Bill though. Do you think that it should be Coalition policy Jacinta Price's Private Members Bill?

Senator Andrew Bragg

I understand that, but when you go out to places in my state, like Western New South Wales, towns like Bourke and Brewarrina I mean, they have similar issues and they've been addressed, or would be better addressed with a permanent structure like community based voices. So I think that's a judgement for the community to make in conjunction with the government, and if you had this structure in place, we would be much better served.

Laura Jayes

Perhaps this is naive, but I do feel like anecdotally there's a lot of goodwill out there that may wane as the debate gets more fierce with the lack of detail, but what is your feeling here, Andrew Bragg? Do you think that the Voice would pass clearly with Australian people?

Senator Andrew Bragg

Look, I really don't know. I think there is a lot of goodwill, but some of the soft support might be falling away because there has been a bit of a vacuum over summer, you have to say. I think that there is still enough time, more than enough time to get the process on track and to present how this change would improve lives but also improve the country. I think there's a lot of goodwill, but we have to make sure we harness it with the right process and ensure that people feel as if voting 'yes' would be a safe change for our system of government.

Laura Jayes

Andrew Bragg, pleasure to have you on the program. Thanks. ‍